Comments on: An Update on the Building Gutted by Fire at 3145 Mt. Pleasant Street http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/ Welcome to the beautiful life Fri, 10 Feb 2012 05:21:04 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: AW http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41340 AW Wed, 26 Aug 2009 03:23:00 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41340 People, these residents aren't poor people trying to live in a trendy or wealthy neighborhood on the tax payers dime. They are hard working, honest people who lived here BEFORE it was trendy and wealthy. Their building was neglected because the owner likey prefered renting to the trendy and wealthy. This isn't about redevelopment; its about people's homes (not an investment condo in a trendy neighborhood). And I wonder how new Mt P residents moved in here on funky loans that lead to a need for bailouts and stimulus plans (ie. tax funded subsidy). If you want to live a community that has zero affordable housing and is just populated by upscale, wealthy clones, I suggest check out VA along the orange line. Some of us like having neighbors from all walks of life. And yes I live in on Mt. Pleasant St. People, these residents aren’t poor people trying to live in a trendy or wealthy neighborhood on the tax payers dime. They are hard working, honest people who lived here BEFORE it was trendy and wealthy. Their building was neglected because the owner likey prefered renting to the trendy and wealthy. This isn’t about redevelopment; its about people’s homes (not an investment condo in a trendy neighborhood). And I wonder how new Mt P residents moved in here on funky loans that lead to a need for bailouts and stimulus plans (ie. tax funded subsidy).

If you want to live a community that has zero affordable housing and is just populated by upscale, wealthy clones, I suggest check out VA along the orange line. Some of us like having neighbors from all walks of life. And yes I live in on Mt. Pleasant St.

]]> By: Nate http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41339 Nate Tue, 25 Aug 2009 19:01:25 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41339 Anon 11:59 - Completely agree with you. Incidentally, DC already offers a ton of assistance to lower and moderate income residents who are trying to buy, including special programs for DC government workers. It's a thousand times wiser to give it to individuals who will buy property, and act as positive forces to clean-up neighborhoods than it is to subsidize some kind of right of return for lower-income individuals to move back into a neighborhood that is rapidly changing and and increasing in affluence. Not to mention, homeowners pump a lot more money back into the city coffers and the local economy, so it's a far better investment on the city's part. Someone needs to remind me why people have a right to live in a given area? We're not talking about some kind of 50s restricted housing, we're discussing a neighborhood that is getting to be more high-rent. If I had Irish heritage, would I deserve a subsidy to rent for cheap at 4th and Mass because Swampoodle was there? Should I get taxpayers' money to rent in Logan because I'm gay? I'm looking to buy and can't afford to stay in Mount Pleasant as an owner where I have lived for 5 years. Do I deserve more public money than another DC resident of similar circumstances and income is eligible for to make that possible, simply because I currently live there? No. I need to make more money, basically. Admittedly, I am leaving by choice, not being displaced by unfortunate circumstances. But you know what? Sh*t happens. Neighborhoods become unaffordable. Who said you have a right to live by your job? That's a luxury! And incidentally, there's still a lot of cheap housing in MTP, but not enough to support 15 bodegas. Develop this land as the market dictates, the empty storefronts will disappear, the tax base will grow. And then watch us have the same argument in a few years about Kennedy St or RI Ave in NE, or wherever the people who can't afford Mount Pleasant any longer move to, families and young kids alike. That's how it works, fair or not. Why waste money fighting an inexorable force (that incidentally has changed DC form a dangerous laughingstock into a pretty damn cool city). Anon 11:59 – Completely agree with you. Incidentally, DC already offers a ton of assistance to lower and moderate income residents who are trying to buy, including special programs for DC government workers. It’s a thousand times wiser to give it to individuals who will buy property, and act as positive forces to clean-up neighborhoods than it is to subsidize some kind of right of return for lower-income individuals to move back into a neighborhood that is rapidly changing and and increasing in affluence. Not to mention, homeowners pump a lot more money back into the city coffers and the local economy, so it’s a far better investment on the city’s part.

Someone needs to remind me why people have a right to live in a given area? We’re not talking about some kind of 50s restricted housing, we’re discussing a neighborhood that is getting to be more high-rent. If I had Irish heritage, would I deserve a subsidy to rent for cheap at 4th and Mass because Swampoodle was there? Should I get taxpayers’ money to rent in Logan because I’m gay? I’m looking to buy and can’t afford to stay in Mount Pleasant as an owner where I have lived for 5 years. Do I deserve more public money than another DC resident of similar circumstances and income is eligible for to make that possible, simply because I currently live there? No. I need to make more money, basically. Admittedly, I am leaving by choice, not being displaced by unfortunate circumstances. But you know what? Sh*t happens. Neighborhoods become unaffordable. Who said you have a right to live by your job? That’s a luxury!

And incidentally, there’s still a lot of cheap housing in MTP, but not enough to support 15 bodegas. Develop this land as the market dictates, the empty storefronts will disappear, the tax base will grow. And then watch us have the same argument in a few years about Kennedy St or RI Ave in NE, or wherever the people who can’t afford Mount Pleasant any longer move to, families and young kids alike. That’s how it works, fair or not. Why waste money fighting an inexorable force (that incidentally has changed DC form a dangerous laughingstock into a pretty damn cool city).

]]> By: L http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41338 L Tue, 25 Aug 2009 18:08:05 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41338 Anon, I don't think you can factor in basement rental income for the bank to qualify you for the loan.... most people who buying a $500k house are making at least $150k. If you're making much less than that, IMO, you're stretching yourself too thin but that's your choice. Anon, I don’t think you can factor in basement rental income for the bank to qualify you for the loan…. most people who buying a $500k house are making at least $150k. If you’re making much less than that, IMO, you’re stretching yourself too thin but that’s your choice.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41337 Anonymous Tue, 25 Aug 2009 17:38:02 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41337 someone paying $3K a month for a rowhouse probably has a basement unit they can rent for $1K, so they're paying $24000 a year in mortgage costs, 1/3 of which is deductible. $171K feels like an extremely high projection for the average income here. how do you know we are "whining" about "relatively miniscule" housing assistance? have you seen numbers? people like Jim Graham routinely hand out millions of dollars for these types of projects. someone paying $3K a month for a rowhouse probably has a basement unit they can rent for $1K, so they’re paying $24000 a year in mortgage costs, 1/3 of which is deductible. $171K feels like an extremely high projection for the average income here.

how do you know we are “whining” about “relatively miniscule” housing assistance? have you seen numbers? people like Jim Graham routinely hand out millions of dollars for these types of projects.

]]> By: L http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41336 L Tue, 25 Aug 2009 16:18:22 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41336 Anon 11:25, the $2600 I think was just the mortgage interest. So the total payment including principal, taxes, and insurance would be over $3000. $171k might be a little high but someone who owns a $538,000 house probably makes at least close to $150k so I think their point stands (that this is a fairly well-off person whining about relatively miniscule housing assistance to the working poor). Anon 11:25, the $2600 I think was just the mortgage interest. So the total payment including principal, taxes, and insurance would be over $3000. $171k might be a little high but someone who owns a $538,000 house probably makes at least close to $150k so I think their point stands (that this is a fairly well-off person whining about relatively miniscule housing assistance to the working poor).

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41335 Anonymous Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:59:20 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41335 Mt P is already in the process of redevelopment - the land values will be attracitve enough to entice developers (once the credit situation improves.) I think what is needed is to target other areas of the city that have been ignored for much longer. I'd rather support redevelopment that allows city workers to purchase a piece of the city rather than simply rent an apartment. Also loans aren't free. The city subsidises the interest and assumes the liability if the projet fails and the loan isn't repaid. Now if the tenants could sue the landlord for negligence, get the building free and clear in a settlement then the case for granting a city-subsidized loan would make more sense, especially if they partner with a group that has a proven track record. Mt P is already in the process of redevelopment – the land values will be attracitve enough to entice developers (once the credit situation improves.) I think what is needed is to target other areas of the city that have been ignored for much longer. I’d rather support redevelopment that allows city workers to purchase a piece of the city rather than simply rent an apartment.
Also loans aren’t free. The city subsidises the interest and assumes the liability if the projet fails and the loan isn’t repaid. Now if the tenants could sue the landlord for negligence, get the building free and clear in a settlement then the case for granting a city-subsidized loan would make more sense, especially if they partner with a group that has a proven track record.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41334 Anonymous Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:25:24 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41334 anon 10:42 what kind of calculation led you to believe that someone who can "make that" $3K a month in mortgage payments makes $171K a year?!? seriously? anon 10:42 what kind of calculation led you to believe that someone who can “make that” $3K a month in mortgage payments makes $171K a year?!? seriously?

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41333 Anonymous Tue, 25 Aug 2009 15:22:29 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41333 but anica the tenants aren't scrounging to buy the building - they're getting a handout from The Grahamstander. but anica the tenants aren’t scrounging to buy the building – they’re getting a handout from The Grahamstander.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41332 Anonymous Tue, 25 Aug 2009 14:42:15 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41332 Sorry anon (and other readers), but I can't let this one drop. You seem to have convinced yourself that you have "earned" your housing subsidy, while those receiving much less in subsidies and having lower incomes are somehow freeloading. I already outlined the fairly simple math above, but here it is in more detail: DC property tax is $0.85/$100 in assessed value over the $67,500 homestead deduction. you said you pay $4k in property taxes a year, meaning your home is assessed at $538,000. Assuming a 10% down payment and 6.5% interest rate, your monthly mortgage interest payment is $2,600, or $31,200. To make that kind of monthly payment, you must be at least in the 33% federal income tax bracket (i.e., more than $171k a year), which is consistent with the income tax you claim to pay. (Anyone crying a river for Anon at this point?) So when you artificially reduce your taxable income by deducting $31,200 in mortgage interest on your tax return, you escape $10,000 in taxes you would otherwise have to pay. Non-homeowner taxpayers are required to pay more in taxes than they otherwise would, in order to pay for this massive subsidy to you. Had you not received the benefit of this subsidy, you not only would not have received $6k refund, but you would have owed $4k more to the IRS. Saying that you still paid something is not an argument that you arent subsidized. Welfare recipients pay various kinds of taxes too. In any case, this $10k you "get back" is not a "small fraction," but over a quarter of the tax burden you would otherwise have, absent the subsidy. Where did you think this money you "get back" was coming from, the Tooth Fairy? No, it's coming from other taxpayers. That's what makes it a subsidy. You need to return that to the government before you can legitimately criticize low income people receiving far less housing subsidy than you. Sorry anon (and other readers), but I can’t let this one drop. You seem to have convinced yourself that you have “earned” your housing subsidy, while those receiving much less in subsidies and having lower incomes are somehow freeloading.

I already outlined the fairly simple math above, but here it is in more detail: DC property tax is $0.85/$100 in assessed value over the $67,500 homestead deduction. you said you pay $4k in property taxes a year, meaning your home is assessed at $538,000. Assuming a 10% down payment and 6.5% interest rate, your monthly mortgage interest payment is $2,600, or $31,200. To make that kind of monthly payment, you must be at least in the 33% federal income tax bracket (i.e., more than $171k a year), which is consistent with the income tax you claim to pay. (Anyone crying a river for Anon at this point?)

So when you artificially reduce your taxable income by deducting $31,200 in mortgage interest on your tax return, you escape $10,000 in taxes you would otherwise have to pay. Non-homeowner taxpayers are required to pay more in taxes than they otherwise would, in order to pay for this massive subsidy to you. Had you not received the benefit of this subsidy, you not only would not have received $6k refund, but you would have owed $4k more to the IRS. Saying that you still paid something is not an argument that you arent subsidized. Welfare recipients pay various kinds of taxes too.

In any case, this $10k you “get back” is not a “small fraction,” but over a quarter of the tax burden you would otherwise have, absent the subsidy. Where did you think this money you “get back” was coming from, the Tooth Fairy? No, it’s coming from other taxpayers. That’s what makes it a subsidy. You need to return that to the government before you can legitimately criticize low income people receiving far less housing subsidy than you.

]]> By: Anica http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41331 Anica Tue, 25 Aug 2009 14:20:47 +0000 http://www.princeofpetworth.com/2009/08/an-update-on-the-building-gutted-by-fire-at-3145-mt-pleasant-street/#comment-41331 I'm with Anonymous at 1:32 a.m. what a bunch of elitist jerks. do you really think policemen, firemen, teachers etc. can afford to live in DC without assistance? and if you don't care, let me ask you if you think a policeman or fireman would just be slightly more invested in the community if he or she actually lived in it. I for one, would not mind living next to a teacher, or a bus driver, or any number of professionals that don't earn what I do. not all people who make less than the median income are hellbent on crime and mayhem. in fact, mixing income levels is one way to alleviate pockets of poverty and therefore crime. I would imagine that a group of tenants scrounging and working hard to buy there own building and rebuild it after a year of displacement would be pretty dedicated to keeping it and their neighborhood nice, safe, and would be good neighbors. I used to live in Mt. P and if I still did I would be happy to have them as my neighbors. HAPPY. even if it comes out of my tax dollars. I’m with Anonymous at 1:32 a.m. what a bunch of elitist jerks. do you really think policemen, firemen, teachers etc. can afford to live in DC without assistance? and if you don’t care, let me ask you if you think a policeman or fireman would just be slightly more invested in the community if he or she actually lived in it. I for one, would not mind living next to a teacher, or a bus driver, or any number of professionals that don’t earn what I do. not all people who make less than the median income are hellbent on crime and mayhem. in fact, mixing income levels is one way to alleviate pockets of poverty and therefore crime. I would imagine that a group of tenants scrounging and working hard to buy there own building and rebuild it after a year of displacement would be pretty dedicated to keeping it and their neighborhood nice, safe, and would be good neighbors. I used to live in Mt. P and if I still did I would be happy to have them as my neighbors. HAPPY. even if it comes out of my tax dollars.

]]>